Deviously Cursed Loot LE 9.0 (2021-03-09)

[thedarkone1234]

35 minutes ago, sargent256 said:

just continue down the cavern looting bodies, the quest maker won't move but there are still some bodies you need to loot, in order to continue the quest,  in the caves past the "squeeze past" point.

hope this helps

Just to add more clarity to that, you are looking for a certain interactable object. The quest will only progress once you have opened your invertory and interacted with it.

I will put the name of he object as a spoiler, to reduce the temptation to console it and because it is a minor quest story spoiler

 

 

 

Spoiler

torn note

 

[Raistlin_]

Kimy , I don't know what the history is with you and Inte , just please don't let whatevers going on get you down.

[ePiKnight]

I'm having issues with DCUR NPCs having red foreheads again (in v8.0). Character makeup wasn't loading properly so I went to CK and updated the faces and they all ended up with red foreheads. Is there something I can do to fix this or is it a "wait until patch" situation?

[L0ller]

6 minutes ago, sargent256 said:

just continue down the cavern looting bodies, the quest maker won't move but there are still some bodies you need to loot, in order to continue the quest,  in the caves past the "squeeze past" point.

hope this helps

Swept cavern again, and found it, thanks! Now I fell stupid.

[Zaflis]

12 minutes ago, ePiKnight said:

I'm having issues with DCUR NPCs having red foreheads again (in v8.0). Character makeup wasn't loading properly so I went to CK and updated the faces and they all ended up with red foreheads. Is there something I can do to fix this or is it a "wait until patch" situation?

Unfortunately it's not a bug in DCUR, you may be the only one seeing the red heads. For quick visit i checked Sasha and Dollmaker and they're fine. This solution in the past helped at least someone, but google may find more:

https://www.loverslab.com/topic/26372-red-foreheads-on-some-female-npc/

 

1 hour ago, L0ller said:

Hi, I have problems with Chloe quest, after I meet, free her and ask her to follow. After "good to go" dialogue I get task to head deeper into the ruins, pointing to powder that is "squeeze past", once I do it, I get to other side, but quest doesn't advance. I took a hint and searched every corpse I could find in Helgen keep and still can't advance the quest. Am I missing something or did it bug out? I tried starting new game with and without LaL, but still stuck in same place-

The cave bugs sometimes so that there are no imperial bodies for you to loot. For some it fixes itself by simply reloading the game, but it may also do something if you complete the Helgen part of dragonborn quests. The right body should be where the spiders are.

[crazyduck]

1 hour ago, Kimy said:

It's work for me. Work, that I'd rather spend doing something else. In this case, literally anything else. Because I am (largely) still not getting paid for doing this. Let's just say, if my Patreon income would be much, MUCH higher than it currently is, I would think about working on things I have no personal interest in, if the people supporting me financially express an interest in certain features.

I didn't -decide- that. There is not one single line of code in DCL sabotaging POP, or any other mod for that matter. The absence of active support doesn't make it a malicious action on my part. The incompatibility is result of two mods doing the same thing. I still owe nobody a minute of my time when I don't want to work on something, and that includes coding compatibility layers with other mods.

Aside from that one technical post, any of their -other- postings should give you a good enough idea why we're not getting along.

I should have done this way earlier, that's for sure. Blame it my being a lot nicer and a lot more patient with other people's crap than I should be, if anything.

That's a pretty nasty accusation. DCL never NEEDED POP at any point in its history and none of its functionality relied on it. What DCL did was handing the player to POP in certain situations. DCL has similar integration with at least a half-dozen other mods. In contrast of what Inte and fans think of me, I believe that mods working together in this fashion benefit them all. Apparently I am building a monopoly by adding more integration features with other mods than any other mod I am aware of.

I removed that compatibility layer not because I can't stand Inte (I lost respect for Inte a while ago, and still left the code in for the longest time, go figure!), but because they failed to update their mods to the newest DD version for way more than a year. Since DCL needs said new version, that in turn makes POP incompatible with DCL.

Ironically enough, Inte's now claiming that DD Equip is fully compatible with DD4 and has been for a long time, or so. Apparently, the big fat red font they used to tell people otherwise on DDe's download page for over a year was just an oversight, but that's Inte for you. Inte makes up their very own version of reality as they see fit.

Another nasty accusation, but hey, I am getting used to that coming from Inte fans. Do you really think I am childish enough to work almost full-time hours for several months on a feature for no other purpose than harming another person's mod? Are you kidding me?

 

The reason for me making that prison was - and I said so a few times already - because I find POP boring, in combination with the fact that it's not a DD mod. I wanted a DD prison. So I made one. End of story.

Sorry Kimy if my Post was not clear enough, english is not my first language so possible some words are not the best to describe something.

 

1. You say it woudl be more work for you, yes thats true, at same time if people could access your scripts they could make a compatiblity patch wihtout any work for you or any support from you.

 

2. Patreon income to be honest i think if someone only add features people ask for if enough cash is payed on patreon its something i would call one of the biggest problems with todays modding scene. would be something else if adding a feature or a compatiblity option would be many many days and weeks of work, but its hard to believe it would be such a big workload to add this compatibility to cursed loot.

 

3. true you owe no one a minute of your time thats 100 true. but and now dont get me wrong , if a game has tons of mods its most of time simple normal time modders invest to make his or her mod compatible with many other mods as far as it possible. as you said both mods doing the same thats right, but this incompatiblity is not some sort of magic curse happening, it was your decision to make it incompatible.

 

4. true cursed loot never needed it but it was nice to have that your mod was compatible with POP also for your mod cause it offered a different Prison and Crime feature as vanilla had. And if you think or believe that it benefit all if mods work togehter then i really cant understand it why your remove compatibiltiy and explain it with " I still owe nobody a minute of my time when I don't want to work on something, and that includes coding compatibility layers with other mods.".

 

5.  Incompatibility wiht the currend DD version, hmm last time i used POP and DDE it wokred without any problems with the current DD 4.2 Version and cursed loot, so it seems it is compatible since some time.  And if its only related to stuff written on the different Mod Pages really, there often are wrong , outdated missleading informations so if thats the reason to stop making somethign work togehter, i think there would be not that many compatible mods anymore if everyone would do that .

 

6. Boring thats interesting and also one of the reason why i as example cant understand this entire "pfff not interestet to make it compatible " thing from you Kimy.

Cause its not like your Prison is something not getting boring really fast. To be honest the few Times i was in your Prison each time made me become more and more sure i need to disable it. Not cause i dont like the layout or the Idea , but cause i dont like this Jailtime every day do the same stuff and only hope day is over now again .

 

And wanting a dd Prison sure why not but this still does not mean it must be incompatible.

Oh and about your question with childish or not, i dont know you good enough to say yes or no to that. I only know i often saw Content Creators also called Modders to invest insane amounts of time only to harm other peoples mods and no i dont want to say you are such a Modder.

 

To bad you keep your Scripts for yourself so its impossibel for others to make a compatibility patch.
 

[Kimy]

36 minutes ago, crazyduck said:

To bad you keep your Scripts for yourself.

Except that I don't. lol

 

I do not allow uploading patched versions of DCL scripts, though.

[crazyduck]

22 minutes ago, Kimy said:

Except that I don't. lol

 

I do not allow uploading patched versions of DCL scripts, though.

you dont? Ok then sorry for that i just checked my cursed loot files and found only 1 source script file .

 

But if you dont allow upload of patched files thats same result no one could make a working patch for something like that right?

 

Ok yes my fault i found them , but still how should a patch be possible if you dont allow uploads of modified cursed loot files?

[Kimy]

1 minute ago, crazyduck said:

you dont? Ok then sorry for that i just checked my cursed loot files and found only 1 source script file .

You probably didn't chose to install them when installing DCL. Most people really don't need them.

1 minute ago, crazyduck said:

 

But if you dont allow upload of patched files thats same result no one could make a working patch for something like that right?

If they can code, they can make a patch for private uses.

[Steelsponge]

Perhaps it is just me, but. whenever my character gets sentenced to the special prison, all i get is a black screen. and it basically freezes my game. any ideas? im wondering if i didnt install something properly. cause i get random crashes too.

[Azengar]

It's sad that you have to fight so much over these compatibility issues, it's your own mod and you do it as you see fit, that's all there is to it. I wonder how some people still fail to understand that.
Anyway, I hope you know that a lot of us respect your decisions and appreciate the amount of work you've put into this mod, thanks for bringing such great things to the community Kimy.

[crazyduck]

35 minutes ago, Kimy said:

You probably didn't chose to install them when installing DCL. Most people really don't need them.

If they can code, they can make a patch for private uses.

Yes Kimy for private use that would be possible and also not the problem with source files for the scripts. but hmm why you dont allow to share such a patch after someone make it? This would not fore you to support it or update it or something like that.

 

As example if would make such a patch how would such a patch coudl have a negative effect for you or the mod itself.

 

@Azengar: Dont get me wrong i also respect kimy and the work she do to make this mod.

I only dont like some sort of incompatiblities if this could be easily resolved , and if this would allow people more different options to play the game i dont think it would be a bad thing.

thats why i also now ask why kimy does not allow people to share patches they made for cursed loot.

 

[Treatedshammy]

On 3/21/2019 at 10:20 PM, Treatedshammy said:

On 3/21/2019 at 2:36 PM, Zaflis said:

Ones that i can see:

1. Cursed Loot LAL addon must be loaded after the Alternate Start. Actually all mods that add scenarios to LAL follow this rule, such as CCAS mod. All the LAL mods should also be last in the load order, except for Bashed Patch if you had one. You can install a tool called LOOT that will organize the load order with a single click, but you will need to start it from MO when using. From Windows shortcut it won't even find all the mods because of MO virtualization, and that is same for FNIS and Bodyslide.

 

2. You don't have any body textures installed. Bodyslide doesn't include all the needed files. Install CBBE or UUNP i recommend.

 

3. You have unmanaged mods in the left side list. This means they are placed in the Skyrim\Data\ directly instead of installed as mods to MO. They should still work though but it's not a recommended practise. If those mods included anything other than .esp files, you might have a mess when it comes to what replaces what.

 

4. NiOverride is already included in RaceMenu, so you don't need to have it second time.

So in order;

1. Thanks I've got that in mind and I'll rearrange, hopefully that'll stop any conflicts.

2. I thought I had these but it seems not, any recommendations from anyone because I seem to be really struggling with what are body textures and what are armour stuff. (if wasn't clear I'm dumb) would be appreciated

3. I'm going to replace those with installed through MO, thankfully it's just the 3 of them at most I believe.

4. I shall uninstall NiOverride then

I've looked aroun dstill but I'm still having trouble. Either I'm still not understanding what UUNP I need, or i still have the 'invisible' issue. I thought I had the right thing with https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/6709 maybe, but it seems not?

[Zaflis]

18 minutes ago, Treatedshammy said:

I've looked aroun dstill but I'm still having trouble. Either I'm still not understanding what UUNP I need, or i still have the 'invisible' issue. I thought I had the right thing with https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/6709 maybe, but it seems not?

That is the correct one. You also need to build the body in Bodyslide afterwards, and run the FNIS. Now i consider this also "required" for UNP:

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/30050

Without it you may get neck or hand seams, very distracting borders where those models connect. But that's really all there is to UNP, other is just fine tuning like eyes, teeth, different faces or sweaty body textures etc.

[Lupine00]

2 hours ago, Kimy said:

I do not allow uploading patched versions of DCL scripts, though.

Does that mean the SLIF patch is not allowed?

[Kimy]

9 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

Does that mean the SLIF patch is not allowed?

I am not sure if that's not clear enough (from DCL's license)?

 

Quote

 

- You can NOT bundle/re-distribute any parts of this mod with your own (e.g. include patched versions of DCL's scripts or ESP in your mod) as future updates might break mine, yours and other mods if you do.

 

If they ship changed versions of DCL's scripts or its ESP, no, it's not allowed. People should know it's a horrible idea to make unsanctioned patches for mods. They are basically guaranteed to break the original mod, their patch or random other stuff every single time the original mod updates. Which in DCL's case happens often enough, for I update my mod quite frequently.

[Lupine00]

32 minutes ago, Zaflis said:

Now i consider this also "required" for UNP:

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/30050

Without it you may get neck or hand seams, very distracting borders where those models connect. But that's really all there is to UNP, other is just fine tuning like eyes, teeth, different faces or sweaty body textures etc.

Whether or not you need that depends on what textures you use. It's clearly intended for Coverwomen, and probably now, more people use FSK, or Demoniac, or something from betterbecause. Though TBH, I don't know...

 

I thought Coverwomen was getting pretty ancient now, and a bit low resolution. Plus, even in 2012 it had its own anti-seam patches.

 

I don't notice seams on Demoniac 8K unless there's a problem in the Bodyslide to start with.

 

And FSK got an update back in October last year, so it's still being improved.

[Lupine00]

6 minutes ago, Kimy said:

If they ship changed versions of DCL's scripts or its ESP, no, it's not allowed.

It should be fairly evident that the only way a SLIF patch can work is to overwrite script files.

SLIF has patches for quite a number of mods.

 

Of course they go out of date. There is always troubling uncertainty whether a patch still works when a mod does an update. SLIF can be slow to track this. For example, there's still a patch for Hormones, which is against an older version, and furthermore, Hormones now has built-in SLIF support.

 

I think people installing patches are mostly well aware of possible version conflicts. The situation with ESP clashes between environment mods is a nightmare in comparison to these simple issues.

 

To prohibit it just because it might break doesn't make all that much sense.

 

I can't imagine a real user that would say: "I patched DCL and now its broken. That must be Kimy's fault, definitely not the patch."

 

 

It's a very different order of objection to prohibiting posts of forks or major variations - full mods.

 

In any case, if you want to go down that path, you probably need to shout at @qotsafan to remove the SLIF patch from the SLIF distro, and possibly incorporate it directly into DCL yourself where you can maintain it... Or if you really hate SLIF, then just the former.

[Treatedshammy]

56 minutes ago, Zaflis said:

That is the correct one. You also need to build the body in Bodyslide afterwards, and run the FNIS. Now i consider this also "required" for UNP:

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/30050

Without it you may get neck or hand seams, very distracting borders where those models connect. But that's really all there is to UNP, other is just fine tuning like eyes, teeth, different faces or sweaty body textures etc.

I will download that as well then.

 

But I did try the game with the UNP I mentioned and I ran the Bodyslide and FNIS, but there was no change. The torso/hobbledress was still invisible.

[Kimy]

4 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

It should be fairly evident that the only way a SLIF patch can work is to overwrite script files.

SLIF has patches for quite a number of mods.

 

Of course they go out of date. There is always troubling uncertainty whether a patch still works when a mod does an update. SLIF can be slow to track this. For example, there's still a patch for Hormones, which is against an older version, and furthermore, Hormones now has built-in SLIF support.

 

I think people installing patches are mostly well aware of possible version conflicts. The situation with ESP clashes between environment mods is a nightmare in comparison to these simple issues.

 

To prohibit it just because it might break doesn't make all that much sense.

 

I can't imagine a real user that would say: "I patched DCL and now its broken. That must be Kimy's fault, definitely not the patch."

 

It's a very different order of objection to prohibiting posts of forks or major variations - full mods.

 

In any case, if you want to go down that path, you probably need to shout at @qotsafan to remove the SLIF patch from the SLIF distro, and possibly incorporate it directly into DCL yourself where you can maintain it... Or if you really hate SLIF, then just the former.

I really don't want to pick another fight right now. But I guess it's clear enough that what SLIF is doing is a blatant violation of DCL's license terms, and I really, REALLY don't want to defend what I am doing against another wave of attacks. Let's just leave it at that.

 

PS: Are we taking about the same kind of oh-so technically experienced users that fail to batch-run Bodyslide on an absolutely daily basis, when the install instructions tell them in bold font to do just that?

[Zaflis]

21 minutes ago, Lupine00 said:

Whether or not you need that depends on what textures you use. It's clearly intended for Coverwomen, and probably now, more people use FSK, or Demoniac, or something from betterbecause. Though TBH, I don't know...

I'm using SG Textures Renewal. And the main thing here that matters that the _sk textures are of same "type". It doesn't them hugely matter what the diffuse textures are, as long as glows are all same set. There are separate face mods that include _sk and using those can mess up the seams. One i use is Pretty Face, which gets overwritten too.

[Azengar]

2 hours ago, crazyduck said:

@Azengar: Dont get me wrong i also respect kimy and the work she do to make this mod.

I only dont like some sort of incompatiblities if this could be easily resolved , and if this would allow people more different options to play the game i dont think it would be a bad thing.

thats why i also now ask why kimy does not allow people to share patches they made for cursed loot.

 

Yes and you have all the rights to do so, but then if she doesn't want to do it she doesn't have to, these kind of things have been going on for a while and I'm sure she'd prefer to spend her energy somewhere else.

If that's so important to you nothing stops you from asking the permission to do a patch.

[crazyduck]

9 minutes ago, Azengar said:

Yes and you have all the rights to do so, but then if she doesn't want to do it she doesn't have to, these kind of things have been going on for a while and I'm sure she'd prefer to spend her energy somewhere else.

If that's so important to you nothing stops you from asking the permission to do a patch.

Azengar the problem is, also if i would ask kimy to make a patch, read some posts above about the slif patch to make it work with cursed loot.

You see what she wrote, so if i would make such a patch for myself its ok but it would stil stay the same basic issue .

 

And to be honest it makes not much sense this "no patched files" thing.  The only thing it stops is that people coudl make patches for cursed loot to change or enhance parts of it.

And this stuff about breaking cursed loot with it, thats nothing kimy need to fix or support, if i install a patch for some mod or make my own i would never say the original mod author has to fix it.

 

And to be honest its not like Modding or Cursed Loot or any other Mod is like Rocket Science, so yes i think People who want to patch the Mod could do that wihtout breaking the Mod or enhance it without breaking it.

 

And about Slif so what will we see next? Slif add Cursed Loot as Incompatible Mod? Or Cursed Loot stops working if Slif is detected? Would be so easy if someone simply allow other Modders to make Patches and leave the Support for this patches to this Modders.

 

[tuxagent7]

I am happy with what Kimy have given us with Devious Cursed Loot and enjoy each update that she has uploaded.

 

It is her mod and her vision and we should RESPECT that.

 

I find myself gratefull that i have this great mod to play with in the first place.

 

I think some users here wants everything but sometimes you cant have it all, accept it and move along

 

 

[crazyduck]

2 minutes ago, tuxagent7 said:

I am happy with what Kimy have given us with Devious Cursed Loot and enjoy each update that she has uploaded.

 

It is her mod and her vision and we should RESPECT that.

 

I find myself gratefull that i have this great mod to play with in the first place.

 

I think some users here wants everything but sometimes you cant have it all, accept it and move along

 

 

I dont want everything but i always think its a bad decision to make somethign incompatible without a real reason , and stuff like ESP Limits are not really a reason its not Kimys job to care for Peoples ESP Limits.

 

but still as i said i dont want everything but at same time this "no patches allowed" thing makes not really sense. but will see will start tomorrow making POP compatible with cursed loot again.